14 replies to this topic

[Miloch]

Gnomes v2 (Beta)

This is a mini-mod that started in this thread, the v1 of which became incorporated in the BG1 NPC Project. I'm putting this out there if anyone wants to beta test, and because Ergopad is doing some similar things for his NPC Attributes mod. It includes the following components, which should be self-explanatory:

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Install Component [Quayle: change weapon]?
[N]o, [Q]uit or choose one:
1] Dagger (Baravar's weapon; allows use by all cleric/mages)
2] Flail (BG1 weapon; STR +2, CON -2; lowers flail STR req. from 13 to 10)
3] Mace (Tutu weapon; STR +1, CON -1; lowers mace STR req. from 10 to 9)
4] Quarter Staff (BGT weapon)

Install Component [Tiax: change weapon]?
[N]o, [Q]uit or choose one:
1] Short sword (Cyric's weapon; allows use of all small blades by cleric/thieves)
2] Mace (BG1/BGT weapon; lowers mace STR req. from 10 to 9)
3] Quarter Staff (Tutu weapon)
4] Dagger (allows use by all cleric/thieves)

Install Component [Quayle: mage instead of cleric avatar]?
[I]nstall, or [N]ot Install or [Q]uit?

Install Component [Tiax: thief instead of cleric avatar]?
[I]nstall, or [N]ot Install or [Q]uit?

Note that I don't intend this to stand on its own as a mod anymore than the original did. It'll probably end up in NPC Attributes or the like, which in turn might get assimilated into MixMod or a larger tweak mod . It most likely won't end up in BG1 NPC, which is no longer subject to added content like this.

Also, I'm putting out for discussion some half-coded future components, including the possibility of:
- new spells (see below)
- special items for NPC gnomes (cloak and wavy dagger of Baravar, symbol of Cyric, etc.)
- option to kit Tiax either as a Cleric/Assassin or Strifeleader of Cyric (from Divine Remix)/Thief
- option to kit Quayle as a Hoodwinker of Baravar (new kit)

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HOODWINKER OF BARAVAR: Baravar Cloakshadow (BARE-uh-vahr CLOKE-sha-doh) is a sly, sneaky protector of the Forgotten Folk. His defenses and protective strategies are rooted in deceit - illusions, traps, ambushes and the like - and his jests and tricks may cause their victims some pain (emotional if not physical). In addition to teaching the arts of disguise, stealth and spying to the gnomes, thy Sly One creates traps and illusions of incredible depth and cunning, a skill he has passed on to the gnomes throughout the Realms.

The church of Baravar is highly regarded for its efforts on behalf of the Forgotten Folk in the ongoing battles between goblins, kobolds and gnomes of the same tunnels and caves, even if the more cultures gnomes find the priesthood's methods somewhat brutish. Baravar's faithful are deservedly admired for their skill in manipulating the Weave and crafting illusions of incredible realism. But their penchant for deception has earned them a measure of distrust among most gnomes, even those who seek to emulate the trickery of Garl Glittergold.

Baravar's priests favor the garb of rogues, including leather armor and light weapons. Their ceremonial garb consists of a hooded black cloak, a gray cloth mask and an ornate silver dagger with a wavy blade. Hoodwinkers must be gnomes, and may be of neutral good, chaotic good, neutral or chaotic neutral alignment.

Abilities:
- Spiritual Weapon: Dagger, "Silver Shadow" once per day
Silver Shadow is the spiritual weapon of Hoodwinkers of Baravar, and is wielded as if the caster had grand mastery in the weapon. Silver Shadow is a regular weapon at levels 1-5, +1 at levels 6-10, +2 at 11-15, +3 at 16-20, +4 at 21-25 and +5 at levels 26 and above. The spiritual weapon lasts for one round per level of the caster, up to 20 rounds.
- May hide in shadows as a ranger of the same level and set snares at 10 points per level
- May cast wizard spells from the illusion school
- From level 3 can cast Mirror Image once per day, as the 2nd-level wizard spell
- From level 5 can cast Phantasmal Mantle once per day, as the 3rd-level specialty priest spell (see below)
- From level 7 can cast Dimension Door once per day, as the 3rd-level wizard spell
- From level 9 can cast Phantasmal Killer once per day, as the 4th-level wizard spell
- From level 11 can cast Mislead once per day, as the 6th-level wizard spell
- From level 14 can cast Prismatic Spray once per day, as the 7th-level wizard spell

Sphere Access:
- Major access to the spheres of all, chaos, charm, creation, elemental earth, elemental fire, guardian, healing, protection, summoning, thought and wards
- Minor access to the spheres of combat, divination, law, sun and travelers
- No access to the spheres of animal, astral, elemental, elemental air, elemental water, necromancy, numbers, plant, time, war and weather

New Spells

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Set Snare (Conjuration)
Level: 1
Sphere: Creation
Range: Touch
Duration: Until triggered
Casting Time: 3
Area of Effect: 3-foot diameter
Saving Throw: None

A snare will cause 5 HP of missile damage to anyone who walks over it except the person who set it and anyone in his party. It can be avoided if detected, or disarmed with the remove traps skill.

Hide in Shadows (Illusion)
Level: 1
Sphere: Wards
Range: Self
Duration: 2 rounds
Casting Time: 0
Area of Effect: Caster
Saving Throw: None

The caster can try to disappear into shadows or any other type of concealment - bushes, curtains, crannies, etc. He can hide this way only when no one is looking at him. The caster can never become hidden while enemies are watching, unless they are blinded or otherwise distracted. Spells and special effects that reveal invisible objects can reveal the location of someone hidden.

Battlefate (Alteration)
Level: 1
Sphere: Chaos
Range: 20
Duration: 2 rounds/level
Casting Time: 4
Area of Effect: 1 creature
Saving Throw: None

This spell alters probability to favor one character or creature locked in battle. His opponent may stumble at an awkward time, a clumsy parry might catch the enemy's weapon at just the riht angle, or he happens to notice the foe moving in for a flank attack. The more powerful the priest, the more potent the aid. Combat modifiers provided by Battlefate equal +1 per three levels, so a 1st-level caster provides a +1 bonus, a 4th-level caster a +2 bonus, a 7th-level caster a +3, and so on to a maximum of +5 for a 13th-level priest. The exact form of the aid or assistance varies from round to round as follows:

d6 Effect
1 Nothing happens
2 Defenses enhanced: apply bonus to subject AC
3 Luck enhanced: apply bonus to saving throws
4 Accuracy enhanced: apply bonus to attack rolls
5 Damage enhanced: apply bonus to damage rolls
6 Lucky opening! Subject gains one extra attack with either enhanced accuracy or damage

Note that on a roll of 1, Battlefate does not help the character the priest intends to aid - such is the nature of chaos.

Chaos Ward (Abjuration)
Level: 2
Sphere: Chaos
Range: Touch
Duration: 2 rounds/level
Casting Time: 5
Area of Effect: Creature touched
Saving Throw: None

By using this spell, the priest can create a shimmering aura of whirling light that surrounds the chosen creature. This protective aura makes the spell recipient more difficult to hit in hand-to-hand combat by providing a -1 bonus to the subject's Armor Class. Against missile attacks or ranged spells aimed directly at the recipient, the Chaos Ward is even more effective since it provides a -2 bonus to AC and a +2 bonus to any saving throws required. In addition, there is a chance that missile attacks or directed spells may be deflected or reflected by the chaotic energy of the shield, as shown below:

d% Effect
01-80 No unusual effect: subject gains normal benefits of Chaos Ward
81-90 Spell or attack automatically defeated
91-100 Spell or attack reflected back at originator: normal attack roll or saving throw applies

In order to qualify as a spell aimed directly at the recipient, a spell must affect only the subject in question. A spell such as Sleep that happens to include the subject in its area of effect does not count as a directed spell and does not trigger the Chaos Ward.

Phantasmal Mantle (Abjuration)
Level: 3
Sphere: Wards
Range: 15
Duration: 10 turns/level
Casting Time: 8
Area of Effect: 30-foot sphere
Saving Throw: None

This spell confers a special magic resistance against illusion and divination spells. This magic resistance functions in a similar manner to standard magic resistance, but only against spells for the schools of illusion or divination. Those protected receive 4% magic resistance per caster level, in addition to saving throws normally allowed. A successful Dispel Magic spell ends the effect prematurely.

Phantasmal Killer (Illusion)
Level: 4
Sphere: Thought
Range: Visual range of caster
Duration: 1 round
Casting Time: 4
Area of Effect: 1 creature
Saving Throw: Special

The caster of this spell creates the illusion of the most fearsome thing imaginable to the victim, simply by forming the fears of the victim's subconscious mind into something that its conscious mind can visualize - the most horrible beast imaginable. If it succeeds in scoring a hit, the subject dies from fright. The beast is invulnerable to all attacks and can pass through barriers. The only defenses against a phantasmal killer are an attempt to disbelieve (saving vs. spell), slaying or rendering unconscious the wizard who cast the spell.

Adamantite Weapon (Alteration)
Level: 4
Sphere: Elemental (Earth)
Range: Touch
Duration: 1 round/level
Casting Time: 7
Area of Effect: Caster's weapon
Saving Throw: None

By means of this spell, the priest casts a powerful enchantment upon his weapon with the strength of adamantite, the most magical mineral known. The Adamantite Weapon gains a +2 bonus to attack and damage rolls for the duration of the spell, which is one round per level of the caster. As an incarnation of elemental earth, the weapon gives a +4 bonus against creatures of elemental air or magical avians such as winged baatezu or tanar'ri.

Edited by Miloch, 02 August 2008 - 04:54 PM.

[cmorgan]

You've been busy

[Galactygon]

Some of those spells look interesting. You ought to talk the creators of the Divine Remix (if they are still around).

-Galactygon

[Miloch]

Galactygon, on Aug 1 2008, 11:37 AM, said:

You ought to talk the creators of the Divine Remix (if they are still around).

They aren't, though my first intention was to do a sort of add-on to DR. Might still do it that way for the spells, if I get around to it again. I did do all the icons at least, which is usually one of the more annoying things to do.

[Bursk]

Great stuff, Miloch!

I was wondering yesterday actually if you'd consider releasing your suggestions in "Enhancement suggestions for DR v6" as an add-on to v5 of DR. I haven't read through that thread in a while, but didn't you come up with some nice re-balancing ideas for the mod?

[Miloch]

Bursk, on Aug 1 2008, 06:55 PM, said:

I was wondering yesterday actually if you'd consider releasing your suggestions in "Enhancement suggestions for DR v6" as an add-on to v5 of DR. I haven't read through that thread in a while, but didn't you come up with some nice re-balancing ideas for the mod?

Indeed, that is probably what I'll end up doing with the kit and the spells. I have at least a dozen or two new druid spells someone else sent me too - I got as far as converting them from IAP/TBG format to WeiDU, but unfortunately that was just the first step... I would have to finish the coding, so it's something of a mid-priority for me, since there are other more pressing mods. But something I'll finish eventually (along with Lost Items and the CoM mods - in fact, some of the druidic content came from those too, indirectly).

[Bursk]

Good stuff. If it's not too much bother, could you perhaps provide a summary of your v6 changes (don't worry about it if it's too much hassle)?

[Miloch]

Bursk, on Aug 2 2008, 10:57 AM, said:

Good stuff. If it's not too much bother, could you perhaps provide a summary of your v6 changes (don't worry about it if it's too much hassle)?

Tell you what - I'll give you the links and you can go through and summarise the potential changes (might make my job easier when I actually get around to this ).

List of Cleric Spell Changes (post 3 onward)
Enhancement suggestions for DR v6
Fixes for Divine Remix v6 (unless they actually make it in the next version)
Druid Spells from Ayce
And of course, this post, except the coded components which will probably end up somewhere else.

Probably duplicate information in some of those posts, but it'd help to weed that out too. I guess someone should move this to the DR forum if that's the way this is going.

[Bursk]

Okay, I'll take a look at those threads and see if I can come up with some sort of summary.

[Bursk]

Miloch, I've got pretty far with checking those threads, but I have some comments/questions in the meantime:

Could Spell Revisions compatibility be considered when making v6 changes, assuming DR is installed after Spell Revisions i.e. try to make the two as compatible as possible?

DR has Spiritual Weapon: Long Sword for the Strifeleader of Cyric kit, but you have Short Sword.

Regarding a kit for Finch, if it's a custom kit (say a variation on the Lorekeeper of Oghma) would you have to install this kit and therefore take up one of the nine slots, or does that not apply to custom kits? Same question applies to Quayle as a Hoodwinker of Baravar. Ah, I guess if we want to use L1NPCs with these kits (say you wanted to specify proficiencies), we'd have to install them and take up two of the nine slots, yes? Speaking of L1NPCs, what do you think about using it to make Quayle (and Aerie?) a Hoodwinker of Baravar/Mage? Would that be good synergy, or just stupid?

Does "May cast wizard spells from the illusion school" mean that the kit can learn wizard spells, or does it simply refer to the additional spells listed beneath? If it does refer to the additional spells, and you do think a Hoodwinker of Baravar/Mage via L1NPCs would work well, would you consider removing the "May cast wizard spells from the illusion school" line? I mean, it's not necessary is it? None of the other DR kits mention spell schools, as far as I know.

Sim mentions in the D0Tweak readme that Dimension Door "can potentially break the game (this was presumably why it was removed in the first place), so be careful how you use it". I don't know if this applies only to BG2, but might be worth keeping in mind if this kit is used for that game.

In the same way that additional spells can be cast from level 3 onwards with the Hoodwinker of Baravar, what about adding something similar to the DR kits (they currently all have additional spells starting at level 7)?

Regarding these additional spells that DR provides, I've just noticed that the DR Stormlord of Talos is supposed to get Storm Shield at level 7, but they appear to get Lightning Bolt instead. Could someone have a quick look at their game to confirm this?

That's all for now. It's gone 9pm here, and I'm unlikely to finish checking those threads until tomorrow.

Edit: I knew I forgot something! At what level will the cloak and wavy dagger of Baravar, symbol of Cyric be given to the NPCs?

Edited by Bursk, 02 August 2008 - 12:20 PM.

[Miloch]

Bursk, on Aug 2 2008, 12:03 PM, said:

Could Spell Revisions compatibility be considered when making v6 changes, assuming DR is installed after Spell Revisions i.e. try to make the two as compatible as possible?

No . Actually, the only possible conflict I can think of would be DR's sphere assignments to default spells (since SR does not AFAIK add new spells). I can't imagine why Demivrgvs would be messing about with that, since spheres do nothing without DR. But you could always ask him.

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DR has Spiritual Weapon: Long Sword for the Strifeleader of Cyric kit, but you have Short Sword.

It should really be long sword, but a short sword would be a long sword to Tiax. A long sword would be in effect a two-handed sword for him. I didn't see a good way of implementing this at the time, though Echon has made some progress with this for shields so maybe it could be done for weapons, but the two-handed flag could be tough.

So I could give Tiax long sword, but I felt short sword is more appropriate, both as a gnome and as a thief (since I feel that backstabbing with two-handed weapons is silly).

Quote

Regarding a kit for Finch, if it's a custom kit (say a variation on the Lorekeeper of Oghma) would you have to install this kit and therefore take up one of the nine slots, or does that not apply to custom kits? Same question applies to Quayle as a Hoodwinker of Baravar. Ah, I guess if we want to use L1NPCs with these kits (say you wanted to specify proficiencies), we'd have to install them and take up two of the nine slots, yes?

The Hoodwinker kit could definitely be race-specific, meaning it would only display (and therefore take up a slot) for PC gnomes. You can have 9 PC kits displayable per race.

I was thinking of making a full-blown kit for Glyphscribe of Deneir, including specialty spells, to make it different from the Oghma kit. As such, it would not be a custom kit necessarily but I suppose it could be. I think Bons was ok either way but most people wanted the Deneir kit IIRC.

Quote

Speaking of L1NPCs, what do you think about using it to make Quayle (and Aerie?) a Hoodwinker of Baravar/Mage? Would that be good synergy, or just stupid? Does "May cast wizard spells from the illusion school" mean that the kit can learn wizard spells, or does it simply refer to the additional spells listed beneath? If it does refer to the additional spells, and you do think a Hoodwinker of Baravar/Mage via L1NPCs would work well, would you consider removing the "May cast wizard spells from the illusion school" line? I mean, it's not necessary is it? None of the other DR kits mention spell schools, as far as I know.

Here is the full rule (from "Demihuman Deities"):

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* Hoodwinkers may cast wizard spells from the illusion/phantasm school as defined in the Limited Wizard Spellcasting section of "Appendix 1: Demihuman Priests." [which says:] In addition to priest spells, such specialty priests can cast wizard spells from the wizard school or school that is indicated in their bullet point list of special abilities. These spells are cast as if the specialty priest were a mage of the same level... Specialty priests with this special ability pray for their wizard spells instead of studying to memorize them, and chose wizard spells replace priest spells potentially available for use for the day. (In other words, the wizard spell occupies a pirest spell slot.)

At first I wasn't sure how to implement this, but now it seems clear that the wizard spells in the illusion school should simply be copied over to Hoodwinker specialty slots. In addition, they'd get the specialty spells already mentioned. And it is for this reason a Hoodwinker/Mage seems a bit redundant, though you could do it with L1NPCs. Technically, gnomes can only be illusionists, so I probably wouldn't offer this sort of rule violation by default (and also, in general, specialty priests cannot be multiclassed).

As for Aerie, I was never really sure about who she worships, but it seems to be both the gnomish Baervan Wildwanderer and the elvish Aerdrie Faenya. This is either a slip-up on the part of the game developers, since Quayle spouts about Baravan in BG1 (and BG1 NPC), whereas in BG2 he talks of Baervan. So they probably got confused about it being the same god, and really, there isn't a huge difference. I've explained this by saying that Quayle educated Aerie about the gnomish pantheon in general, and Baervan (rather than Quayle's personal deity Baravan) was the closest match for Aerie. Someone would probably have to make a custom kit for her, incorporating both Aerdrie and Baervan.

Quote

Sim mentions in the D0Tweak readme that Dimension Door "can potentially break the game (this was presumably why it was removed in the first place), so be careful how you use it". I don't know if this applies only to BG2, but might be worth keeping in mind if this kit is used for that game.

Not sure what D0Tweak does, but it seems more sensible to me to change an overpowered spell rather than remove it entirely. And I don't see as how it's overpowered except that it is abused in some enemy scripts (the Hamadryad in BG1 is one example I can think of offhand). Getting to cast it once per day at 7th level doesn't seem too overpowered, does it?

Quote

In the same way that additional spells can be cast from level 3 onwards with the Hoodwinker of Baravar, what about adding something similar to the DR kits (they currently all have additional spells starting at level 7)?

This is how it should be IMO - both in the PnP resources, and it makes more sense for BG1 balance (something the original DR authors may not have considered initially). But it would be a lot of work, since someone would have to code up new spells for every kit, or at least give them existing spells/abilities (the latter being much easier). Since gnomes get the short end of the stick (no pun intended) and people rarely play them, I don't see a few extra abilities for a gnome-specific kit as unbalancing.

Quote

Regarding these additional spells that DR provides, I've just noticed that the DR Stormlord of Talos is supposed to get Storm Shield at level 7, but they appear to get Lightning Bolt instead. Could someone have a quick look at their game to confirm this?

I don't have it installed at the moment, but just add this for investigation to the list of fixes.

Quote

Edit: I knew I forgot something! At what level will the cloak and wavy dagger of Baravar, symbol of Cyric be given to the NPCs?

There were two ways I thought of doing this, the easy way and the hard way. The easy way is to have them pre-equipped with the items, which therefore won't be that powerful. The hard way is to devise specific BG1 NPC-style quests for them to gain the items somehow. I'm sure most folks would prefer the latter, but of course, being the hard way, would require a lot of coding. I'm open to hear quest ideas if anyone has any. I could also do a hybrid approach, where they get low-powered versions of the items to start with, but can do the quest to upgrade them (Item Upgrade style, possibly by recovering some rare material to combine with the items). This is probably the best option, since it means I can implement the easy option straightaway and leave the quest coding for a future release (a "more future" release, that is).

[Demivrgvs]

Quote

Quote

Could Spell Revisions compatibility be considered when making v6 changes, assuming DR is installed after Spell Revisions i.e. try to make the two as compatible as possible?

No . Actually, the only possible conflict I can think of would be DR's sphere assignments to default spells (since SR does not AFAIK add new spells). I can't imagine why Demivrgvs would be messing about with that, since spheres do nothing without DR. But you could always ask him.

Technically there shouldn't be any incompatibility between the two mods but I haven't tested it, it would be great if anyone try it out and let us know. Anyway here's a summary of my doubts about it:

- some SR may have different spell school or sphere, but it shouldn't create nothing more than a slight inconsistency if any.

- SR adds some spell to druids (Ice Storm, Polymorph Others) and I'm planning to do a few of these changes (like giving Energy Drain and Control Undead to clerics). I don't know how this is handled by DR, are they assigned to priests as SR impose regardless of the sphere assignements?

- SR's priest spell already apply some restrictions (e.g. Animal Summoning and Barkskin are druid only) and rearranges some spells (e.g. Zone of Sweet Air, now replaced by Gust of Wind, is made available to druids). I don't know how this is handled by DR, what if DR wants to assign to clerics a spell that SR makes unavailable to them?

[Miloch]

Demivrgvs, on Aug 3 2008, 03:57 AM, said:

- SR adds some spell to druids (Ice Storm, Polymorph Others) and I'm planning to do a few of these changes (like giving Energy Drain and Control Undead to clerics). I don't know how this is handled by DR, are they assigned to priests as SR impose regardless of the sphere assignements?

Not sure what you're asking; can you rephrase it? Not that I'm necessarily going to know the answer, since I'm not intimately familiar with all the DR code.

Quote

- SR's priest spell already apply some restrictions (e.g. Animal Summoning and Barkskin are druid only) and rearranges some spells (e.g. Zone of Sweet Air, now replaced by Gust of Wind, is made available to druids). I don't know how this is handled by DR, what if DR wants to assign to clerics a spell that SR makes unavailable to them?

Maybe this is the same question as above, but I believe DR removes all class (cleric/druid/ranger) restrictions from spells, then reimplements them by sphere, which I think it handles via custom 2da files. For standard spells, they'll be handled the same way they are already in DR. But if you're adding new spells, you may need to make them specifically compatible with DR since (as we've discussed before) there is no "sphere" flag on spell files. And while you're at it, you might want to check that DR, Ayce's druid spells (linked above), Morrow Gate/Natural Selection, SpellPack or some other mod isn't already adding the same druid spells (or maybe that's where you're getting them, I don't know). It's inconvenient to have two spells with the same name, even if they have two icons and/or do different things.

[Demivrgvs]

Quote

Quote

- SR adds some spell to druids (Ice Storm, Polymorph Others) and I'm planning to do a few of these changes (like giving Energy Drain and Control Undead to clerics). I don't know how this is handled by DR, are they assigned to priests as SR impose regardless of the sphere assignements?

Not sure what you're asking; can you rephrase it? Not that I'm necessarily going to know the answer, since I'm not intimately familiar with all the DR code.

Are these SR's new spells assigned to priests at all by DR?

Quote

And while you're at it, you might want to check that DR, Ayce's druid spells (linked above), Morrow Gate/Natural Selection, SpellPack or some other mod isn't already adding the same druid spells (or maybe that's where you're getting them, I don't know).

I've done (and will do) something similar to Ayce's mod, but SR stays more close to PnP (at least at the moment). Ayce assigned to druids spells like web, glitterdust, haste, cone of cold, ... which are clearly not priest's spell in PnP. Anyway his selection is quite reasonable and I'll think about it.

[Miloch]

Demivrgvs, on Aug 3 2008, 04:49 AM, said:

Are these SR's new spells assigned to priests at all by DR?

I don't think so. You might check how Morrow Gate handles this, which has new druid spells the author says he made DR compatible. Also yarpen has some druid kits that do the same.

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I've done (and will do) something similar to Ayce's mod, but SR stays more close to PnP (at least at the moment). Ayce assigned to druids spells like web, glitterdust, haste, cone of cold, ... which are clearly not priest's spell in PnP. Anyway his selection is quite reasonable and I'll think about it.

I haven't verified Ayce's spells; like I said, all I've done so far is convert it to WeiDU. If it's going in a DR add-on, I'd want to keep it close to PnP, as is the original intent of DR. However, Web and other wizard spells are druid (Avenger kit) spells already. As for the others, I'd have to look at PnP resources, think about sphere assignments, etc. I would hope at least that if we're implementing similar or similarly-named spells, we can agree on standard resource naming and/or auto-detect/auto-skip components. Like I said, it's inconvenient to have duplicates (or apparent duplicates) in the spell books. Indeed, you might just think about contributing any new priest spells to this mod as a common effort, rather than tacking them on to SR (the "Revisions" in the name seems to imply a revision of existing spells).