23 replies to this topic

[Gorlash]

I'm wondering if it was an intentional decision to make quest experience for these quests so small?? Even the largest of the quests gives, what, 300 XP?? And most are half that or less - and it's divided across the entire party.

By the time the players get to L5 or so, it takes tens of thousands of XP to gain a level; the XP awards for the quests in this package are essentially 0, relative to useful XP levels for the characters. And why even bother distinguishing between 50 or 150 or 300 XP. I could kill a couple of ogres for that. My feeling on this is:

- If you *really* didn't want to give XP awards (i.e., the quests was simply supposed to be entertaining [and they WERE, I really enjoyed all the quests in this package, and it was nice to have new experiences in BG1 after having replayed many times through the years]), then I suggest make every quest return 6 XP (one per character) - that will make the intent obvious.
- However, if the quest is actually supposed to have an XP reward, I think it should be a meaningful amount (1000 XP per player level?? that's just arbitrary numbers picked out of the air, but it's at least meaningful).

Just my 0.02 euros worth...

[jastey]

Thank you for the feedback!

The amount of XP was discussed heavily... I admit that I thought the current amount is not too far from what the game itself gives as a reward for these kind of quests. It's the small numbers that add, so to say. It would be inappropriate if, say, the half-ork encounter let the character raise a level.

I am open to discussion here, but right now I think the amounts are small enough not to be too huge.

I definitely want them to be consistent with the rest of the game. How much XP does the party gain for quests like "return the dead cat to the kid", for example? I can't remember.

[Gorlash]

jastey, on May 15 2008, 10:33 AM, said:

I definitely want them to be consistent with the rest of the game. How much XP does the party gain for quests like "return the dead cat to the kid", for example? I can't remember.

Well, just for comparison, I get 40-70 XP just for disarming a trap!!
I don't remember what XP I got for "return the dead cat"... If this has already been discussed, though, I guess it's already been sufficiently analyzed!

Unfortunately, I've finished BG1 now and am ensconced in Irenicus' dungeon now. I'll have to replay at some point and look at these points... Thanks for your responses!!

[Daulmakan]

jastey, on May 15 2008, 03:33 PM, said:

I definitely want them to be consistent with the rest of the game. How much XP does the party gain for quests like "return the dead cat to the kid", for example? I can't remember.

If you're nice, 200 XP +Reputation +1 +Scroll of Protection from Undead.

If not, 200 XP plus her allowance of 23 gp.

[Miloch]

Gorlash, on May 15 2008, 10:41 AM, said:

However, if the quest is actually supposed to have an XP reward, I think it should be a meaningful amount (1000 XP per player level?? that's just arbitrary numbers picked out of the air, but it's at least meaningful).

I wouldn't change it - not to what you suggest, anyway. It's somewhere between "meaningless" and what you describe as "meaningful," which would be nearly enough XP to give a thief a whole level up just for completing one mini-quest. It's not like it's hard to gain XP in any of the BG games, and particularly not if you're playing with mods. Also, the trap disarming rewards are wack in the BG1 portion of BGT, unless you use one of the tweaks somewhere to nerf those properly.

As Daulmakan says, you get 200 XP for returning the dead cat in BG1. But again, these rewards were designed without knowing you'd be slapping a bunch of megamods and extra quests on top of it.

[jastey]

I am sorry that XP rewards cause (so much) irritation but I am all with Miloch here. Thinking about all the other mods that also add XP and the amount given by the original game quests I think the amounts given by BGQE aren't too small.
And, in original BG1 there is no reward for disarming traps at all. (Zed Nocear made a mod for that, though.)

[LoneRogue]

Hey jastey,

I'm with you on the XP values. I actually think that there's too much XP awarded throughout Baldur's Gate as it is for the simplest of tasks. When you include all the gold, magic items, and reputation awards, I'm surprised there isn't MVP medals handed out at the end of each chapter too!!

I like to work hard for my experience points; it makes for a much more challenging and enjoyable game. Just like many of the RPG games of old (i.e. Bard's Tale, Ultima, Wizardry, and etc.), you got nada for everything save destroying monsters and collecting treasure.

BTW, I am thoroughly enjoying BGQE. I even found myself getting annoyed (like my character was) with babysitting those two brats!! Excellent job!!

Cheers,
LoneRogue

[jastey]

Thank you for the feed back!

LoneRogue, on May 17 2008, 01:03 AM, said:

BTW, I am thoroughly enjoying BGQE. I even found myself getting annoyed (like my character was) with babysitting those two brats!!

Hmyeah, I already got the criticism it might be one of The Reasons not to get children - for those out there that haven't any yet: Be assured, children are not always like that!! Only... in 99.9 % of the time.

[Shaitan]

Well my kids are only 75% like that.

Regarding XP: I think jastey did a very good job. The only thing I ever thought perhaps causing troubles was the rep points given ie by the lady in red in Beregost.

[jastey]

Shaitan, on May 17 2008, 10:35 PM, said:

Well my kids are only 75% like that.

Mine aren't that bad, either.

Shaitan, on May 17 2008, 10:35 PM, said:

Regarding XP: I think jastey did a very good job. The only thing I ever thought perhaps causing troubles was the rep points given ie by the lady in red in Beregost.

Thank you!
Do you think there are too many rep increases available? Actually, reputation increase for the slime quest only happens if you are friendly in the final dialogue, if you are not, there won't be any. For the babysitting quest, the PC can explicitely say that he doesn't want this to be spread around - no reputation increase, either. The couple in Beregost won't tell anyone anyway, so no reputation increase after solving the quest. The only one that can't held her tongue is the daughter Annie, so if you give the family treasure to her afterwards as a gift, reputation will go up by one. The fallen paladin gives no rep increase, since who would believe a fallen Paladin, and he is out of town after the quest anyway. No rep increase after saving the boy from the wyvern, either, or after helping the lady in the Fishing Village.
The only fixed rep increase is after helping the couple in Candlekeep.
For mean HCs, there are quite a few rep looses available, too, btw.

[Shaitan]

Quote

Actually, reputation increase for the slime quest only happens if you are friendly in the final dialogue, if you are not, there won't be any.

As I stated in an previous thread I tend to think of the slime quest and thus no rep points should be given. But when that is said your quest pack is mandatory for me. The small quests fits so good into the whole story in BG1.

[jastey]

Ah, now I remember the discussion, yes. Sorry, temporarily memory loss.

Thank you for the kind words!

[LoneRogue]

jastey, on May 16 2008, 10:28 PM, said:

LoneRogue, on May 17 2008, 01:03 AM, said:

BTW, I am thoroughly enjoying BGQE. I even found myself getting annoyed (like my character was) with babysitting those two brats!!

Hmyeah, I already got the criticism it might be one of The Reasons not to get children - for those out there that haven't any yet: Be assured, children are not always like that!! Only... in 99.9 % of the time.

Hey jastey,

Just so you know, I have a daughter of my own and she is absolutely wonderful, so my comments above were meant to amuse, not to stereotype.

Although, having three sisters myself, I think that the bickering between siblings is pretty close!!

Cheers,
LoneRogue

Edited by LoneRogue, 27 May 2008 - 09:54 PM.

[jastey]

Bickering between siblings that are of this age, especially. I have no experience with elder children, people say they start getting very complicated around 13 / 14. (If I'll still mod then maybe that will become BGQE quest no. 54.)

[Ithildur]

Please don't crank up the xp rewards for these quests. There are too many people who like to install dozens of mods in their games that give out uber loot and xp like cheap candy and think that's a fun way to play; it may be for some, but it fundamentally changes the feel and nature of the game which this quest mod is not meant to do. I really appreciated and enjoyed the fact that this mod is subtle and tasteful, not something that hits you over the head with a hundred thousand xp and +5 vorpal weapons everywhere.

In fact, I think the quest that can be completed in the prologue gives way too much xp (iirc 300 or 500 xp) which if you think about it it's actually a pretty big game balance shifter at lvl 1, making you suddenly halfway to lvl 2 for some classes before even leaving Candlekeep, and possible doubling the amount of xp you start out ch. 1 with. Perhaps consider toning this one down, to make it comparable to the other rewards given in the prologue?

thanks, really enjoying the quests so far

Edited by Ithildur, 03 March 2009 - 03:52 AM.