This thread is for any bug reports, comments or suggestions for the geomantic sorcerer kit.
I'd love to hear people's opinion on balancing issues (yes the kit can be overpowered at high levels), as well as suggestions for places to apply the kit in BGTuTu/BGT games and stand alone ToB games. They don't necessarily need to be tied into amnesia cures. One idea for example in BGTutu would be for some druid to comment that the PC sorcerer who meets the kit requirements seems to be very attuned to nature and to offer to help them explore that potential.
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Geomantic Sorcerer Kit
Started by Caedwyr, Nov 05 2007 08:22 AM
115 replies to this topic
#2
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Posted 05 November 2007 - 09:37 AM
Caedwyr, on Nov 5 2007, 11:27 AM, said:
I'd love to hear people's opinion on balancing issues (yes the kit can be overpowered at high levels), as well as suggestions for places to apply the kit in BGTuTu/BGT games and stand alone ToB games. They don't necessarily need to be tied into amnesia cures. One idea for example in BGTutu would be for some druid to comment that the PC sorcerer who meets the kit requirements seems to be very attuned to nature and to offer to help them explore that potential.
Don't you worry about Planet Express, let me worry about blank.
#3
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Posted 05 November 2007 - 12:26 PM
Decided to do a typo-hunt since I had too much free time this morning. Starting on those that are only on the project page here at G3:
Phew!
Good job remaking this, by the way. It seems a bit overpowered for me to use regularly, but I might try it once with a small party sometime. Balancing it with the regular classes is probably an impossible task, but after some ToB testing, you could probably tone down the HLAs a bit.
I agree that Gorion would be an excellent choice for BG1 placement - not only would it be reasonable to assume that he might have some knowledge of this, but he knows you better than most everyone else and therefore would have noticed any special talents you may have demonstrated. It's also a good time for him to encourage you to develop these talents, with your life soon being in great danger.
]The Geomantic Sorcerer Kit is strongly based on the Druidic Sorcerer Kit by Constant Gaw, and resurrected by hlidskialf and loosely based on the Geomancer presitige [ said:
(=>prestige)[/u] class from the AD&D 3rd Edition Masters of the Wild manual.
...
Requirements:
- 13 Wisdom, 9 Charisma.
- Must be of any Neutral alignment. (duplicate line replacing another requirement)
- Must be of any Neutral alignment.
...
Requirements:
- 13 Wisdom, 9 Charisma.
- Must be of any Neutral alignment. (duplicate line replacing another requirement)
- Must be of any Neutral alignment.
setup.tra said:
@102=~GEOMANTIC SORCERER: The cleric reaches out to a higher power. The wizard trust (=>trusts, grammar) only in eldritch tomes. The druid looks to nature for her spells. To the geomantic sorcerer, however (add a comma after 'however') all magic is the same. Geomancy is the art of channeling magical energy from many sources through the land itself. The spells he casts through his connections with the earth are reflections of his own strength of will.
Advantages:
- Learns druid spells in addition to sorcerer spells and casts them from the sorcerer's spellbook.
- At level 8, can shapeshift into new druid animal forms, gains an additional use every 3 levels.
- Gains special High Level Abilities, including Quest Spells and Level 10 Wizard Spells.
- Can learn high level Quintessence Magic.
Disadvantages:
- Has a 15% penalty to experience.
- Strength, Constitution, and Dexterity have a -2 penalty.
- Has a -1 (shorter casting time is better, so -1 sounds like a good thing - perhaps reword as "Has a penalty of 1 to casting speed.") penalty to casting time.
Requirements:
- 13 Wisdom, 9 Charisma.
- Must be of any Neutral alignment.
- Must have a base class of sorcerer.
Restrictions:
- Sorcerer Item usage.
- Recognized as a sorcerer.
Quintessence Magic:
Quintessence Magic draws directly upon magic in its basic form, free of intermediaries such as deities, the Weave, or structured spellcasting. It is an inherently intuitive blending of the arcane and the natural forces in the world and cannot be taught or granted.~
@232=~Tracking
With an intimate knowledge of his surroundings and the creatures that live within them, a ranger (I think this description is for the Dog's tracking ability - if this is seen in game, perhaps the whole sentence should be rewritten?) can use the Tracking ability to give himself a general idea of what creatures are in an area and which direction they are. Red arrows at the edge of the screen will point in the general direction of the creatures in the area.~
@263=~Mordekinan's (is this supposed to be Mordenkainen? If so, it also needs to be replaced in @262 and @264) Multiplicative Magic Missile~
@276=~Delayed Blast Explosion (Invocation/Evocation)
Level: 7
Range: Visual range of caster
Duration: Special
Casting Time: 7
Area of Effect: 60' radius
Saving Throw: 3/4
This spell creates a massive fireball that hovers at a point determined by the caster. The fireball will stay in position until someone walks too close to it. At which point (this starts a sentence fragment - changing the period into a comma should fix things) it will explode for 15d6 points of damage with a save vs. spell for three-quarters damage. The resulting explosion creates a massive expanding shockwave that stretches out in a 60-foot radius. Its relatively slow expansion gives the caster and his party time to flee.~
@298=~Earthly Planeswalking~
@299=~(TIER 3 ABILITY)
Earthly Planeswalking:
Having mastered the elements, it is now possible for the geomantic sorcerer to meld into any terrestial (=>terrestrial) environment, moving through the ground or air at will, reappreaing (=>reappearing - note, both of these changes also need to be applied to @333) anywhere onscreen in humanoid form.
Requires: Elemental Transformation.~
@317=~Essence of the Planes
(Quintessence Magic)
School: Any School
Range: Visual range of caster
Duration: 20 rounds
Casting Time: 9
Area of Effect: Special
Saving Throw: None
This spell summons an Orb of Pure Energy for 20 rounds. This Orb has many abilities, both offensive and defensive, and its mere proximity to both friend and foe has significant effect. The caster can shape its energy into many different uses, but must remain within visual distance to maintain control.
Close proximity to the orb will result in the following effects, occuring (=>occurring) once each round:
Enemies:
Horror, Blindness, Ray of Enfeeblement, Remove Magic, Secret Word, Hold Monster, Miscast Magic.
All of these spells are cast identically to their wizard-spell counterparts as though the Orb were a 25th level wizard. In addition, all creatures of 8 hit dice or lower are instatnly (=>instantly) slain, as per the 6th level wizard spell, Death Spell.
Allies:
All friendly creatures slowly regenerate when near the Orb. In addition, they gain a bonus of 1 to their casting speed, a +1 bonus to all stats, a bonus of 1 to all saving throws, and a bonus of 1 to their speed factor.
The Orb is able to cast the following spells:
Elemental Phasing (four times per day)
The Orb selects a target and sends 10 magical orbs flying at it. Each of these orbs, upon hitting the target, will phase the victim briefly into one of the 4 elemental planes for a split second before bringing them back. These short forays will result in a small amountof (=>amount of) elemental damage (1d2), although at the end of the journey there is a 20% chance that the target will be level drained (5 levels), feebleminded (4 rounds), or stunned (4 rounds) from the shock of travel. There is a 5% chance tha (=>that) the victim will not be able to withstand the shock and will die instantly.
Energy Shockwave (four times per day)
This spell sends out (remove?) all enemies near the orb flying backwards, dealing 1d20 points of damage and slowing their movement rate by 75% for 1 round.
Energy Exchange (four times per day)
All enemies within the selected radius will be struck by lightning bolts, each dealing 5d5 points of damage.
Ball Electricity (twenty times per day)
This is the Orb's basic attack which deals 3d6 points of electrical damage and 3d6 points of crushing damage to a single target.
Requires: Spell Enhancement.~
Advantages:
- Learns druid spells in addition to sorcerer spells and casts them from the sorcerer's spellbook.
- At level 8, can shapeshift into new druid animal forms, gains an additional use every 3 levels.
- Gains special High Level Abilities, including Quest Spells and Level 10 Wizard Spells.
- Can learn high level Quintessence Magic.
Disadvantages:
- Has a 15% penalty to experience.
- Strength, Constitution, and Dexterity have a -2 penalty.
- Has a -1 (shorter casting time is better, so -1 sounds like a good thing - perhaps reword as "Has a penalty of 1 to casting speed.") penalty to casting time.
Requirements:
- 13 Wisdom, 9 Charisma.
- Must be of any Neutral alignment.
- Must have a base class of sorcerer.
Restrictions:
- Sorcerer Item usage.
- Recognized as a sorcerer.
Quintessence Magic:
Quintessence Magic draws directly upon magic in its basic form, free of intermediaries such as deities, the Weave, or structured spellcasting. It is an inherently intuitive blending of the arcane and the natural forces in the world and cannot be taught or granted.~
@232=~Tracking
With an intimate knowledge of his surroundings and the creatures that live within them, a ranger (I think this description is for the Dog's tracking ability - if this is seen in game, perhaps the whole sentence should be rewritten?) can use the Tracking ability to give himself a general idea of what creatures are in an area and which direction they are. Red arrows at the edge of the screen will point in the general direction of the creatures in the area.~
@263=~Mordekinan's (is this supposed to be Mordenkainen? If so, it also needs to be replaced in @262 and @264) Multiplicative Magic Missile~
@276=~Delayed Blast Explosion (Invocation/Evocation)
Level: 7
Range: Visual range of caster
Duration: Special
Casting Time: 7
Area of Effect: 60' radius
Saving Throw: 3/4
This spell creates a massive fireball that hovers at a point determined by the caster. The fireball will stay in position until someone walks too close to it. At which point (this starts a sentence fragment - changing the period into a comma should fix things) it will explode for 15d6 points of damage with a save vs. spell for three-quarters damage. The resulting explosion creates a massive expanding shockwave that stretches out in a 60-foot radius. Its relatively slow expansion gives the caster and his party time to flee.~
@298=~Earthly Planeswalking~
@299=~(TIER 3 ABILITY)
Earthly Planeswalking:
Having mastered the elements, it is now possible for the geomantic sorcerer to meld into any terrestial (=>terrestrial) environment, moving through the ground or air at will, reappreaing (=>reappearing - note, both of these changes also need to be applied to @333) anywhere onscreen in humanoid form.
Requires: Elemental Transformation.~
@317=~Essence of the Planes
(Quintessence Magic)
School: Any School
Range: Visual range of caster
Duration: 20 rounds
Casting Time: 9
Area of Effect: Special
Saving Throw: None
This spell summons an Orb of Pure Energy for 20 rounds. This Orb has many abilities, both offensive and defensive, and its mere proximity to both friend and foe has significant effect. The caster can shape its energy into many different uses, but must remain within visual distance to maintain control.
Close proximity to the orb will result in the following effects, occuring (=>occurring) once each round:
Enemies:
Horror, Blindness, Ray of Enfeeblement, Remove Magic, Secret Word, Hold Monster, Miscast Magic.
All of these spells are cast identically to their wizard-spell counterparts as though the Orb were a 25th level wizard. In addition, all creatures of 8 hit dice or lower are instatnly (=>instantly) slain, as per the 6th level wizard spell, Death Spell.
Allies:
All friendly creatures slowly regenerate when near the Orb. In addition, they gain a bonus of 1 to their casting speed, a +1 bonus to all stats, a bonus of 1 to all saving throws, and a bonus of 1 to their speed factor.
The Orb is able to cast the following spells:
Elemental Phasing (four times per day)
The Orb selects a target and sends 10 magical orbs flying at it. Each of these orbs, upon hitting the target, will phase the victim briefly into one of the 4 elemental planes for a split second before bringing them back. These short forays will result in a small amountof (=>amount of) elemental damage (1d2), although at the end of the journey there is a 20% chance that the target will be level drained (5 levels), feebleminded (4 rounds), or stunned (4 rounds) from the shock of travel. There is a 5% chance tha (=>that) the victim will not be able to withstand the shock and will die instantly.
Energy Shockwave (four times per day)
This spell sends out (remove?) all enemies near the orb flying backwards, dealing 1d20 points of damage and slowing their movement rate by 75% for 1 round.
Energy Exchange (four times per day)
All enemies within the selected radius will be struck by lightning bolts, each dealing 5d5 points of damage.
Ball Electricity (twenty times per day)
This is the Orb's basic attack which deals 3d6 points of electrical damage and 3d6 points of crushing damage to a single target.
Requires: Spell Enhancement.~
Phew!
Good job remaking this, by the way. It seems a bit overpowered for me to use regularly, but I might try it once with a small party sometime. Balancing it with the regular classes is probably an impossible task, but after some ToB testing, you could probably tone down the HLAs a bit.
I agree that Gorion would be an excellent choice for BG1 placement - not only would it be reasonable to assume that he might have some knowledge of this, but he knows you better than most everyone else and therefore would have noticed any special talents you may have demonstrated. It's also a good time for him to encourage you to develop these talents, with your life soon being in great danger.
#4
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Posted 05 November 2007 - 12:40 PM
Thanks for the typo/proofreading.
I'm currently doing a non-developer playthrough (no killswords and CLUAConsole) and so far I'm finding the kit to be versitile but not overpowered. The 15% experience penalty really hurts, so the class tends to be underleveled most of the time. Of course, I'm also playing with DEFJAM using a starting experience of 9000 for Player1, no xp from spell scribing, and 10% xp from picking locks and disarming traps. In a solo game this'd probably be different and I'm sure it will become less of an issue at the higher levels.
The Gorion suggestion is exactly what I'm looking for. Future versions will include a method for obtaining the kit at that point in the game.
I'm hoping to hear some feedback on the HLAs after some playtesting. Most of my playtesting was aimed at "does this work or not". They tend to look good on paper, but I'm uncertain how much I'd use several of them due to some of the limitations/drawbacks. In the end, I may not end up doing much as far as rebalancing them goes as I was mostly just out to get some form of the Druidic Sorcerer kit to actually work and be stable in a game. My next sorcerer kit offering is the one I'm really going to worry about game balance over. Everyone needs to make at least one +12 hackmaster.
I'm currently doing a non-developer playthrough (no killswords and CLUAConsole) and so far I'm finding the kit to be versitile but not overpowered. The 15% experience penalty really hurts, so the class tends to be underleveled most of the time. Of course, I'm also playing with DEFJAM using a starting experience of 9000 for Player1, no xp from spell scribing, and 10% xp from picking locks and disarming traps. In a solo game this'd probably be different and I'm sure it will become less of an issue at the higher levels.
The Gorion suggestion is exactly what I'm looking for. Future versions will include a method for obtaining the kit at that point in the game.
I'm hoping to hear some feedback on the HLAs after some playtesting. Most of my playtesting was aimed at "does this work or not". They tend to look good on paper, but I'm uncertain how much I'd use several of them due to some of the limitations/drawbacks. In the end, I may not end up doing much as far as rebalancing them goes as I was mostly just out to get some form of the Druidic Sorcerer kit to actually work and be stable in a game. My next sorcerer kit offering is the one I'm really going to worry about game balance over. Everyone needs to make at least one +12 hackmaster.
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Posted 05 November 2007 - 04:31 PM
Just wanted to say this kit looks exciting and is very fresh. I'm looking forward to playing it in my next game.
One question about the HLAs: does the sorcerer still have access to all of the normal wizard HLAs in addition to the 4 "tracks"?
Can only 1 track be chosen or can multiple tracks be chosen?
One question about the HLAs: does the sorcerer still have access to all of the normal wizard HLAs in addition to the 4 "tracks"?
Can only 1 track be chosen or can multiple tracks be chosen?
Caedwyr, on Nov 5 2007, 12:45 PM, said:
Thanks for the typo/proofreading.
I'm currently doing a non-developer playthrough (no killswords and CLUAConsole) and so far I'm finding the kit to be versitile but not overpowered. The 15% experience penalty really hurts, so the class tends to be underleveled most of the time. Of course, I'm also playing with DEFJAM using a starting experience of 9000 for Player1, no xp from spell scribing, and 10% xp from picking locks and disarming traps. In a solo game this'd probably be different and I'm sure it will become less of an issue at the higher levels.
The Gorion suggestion is exactly what I'm looking for. Future versions will include a method for obtaining the kit at that point in the game.
I'm hoping to hear some feedback on the HLAs after some playtesting. Most of my playtesting was aimed at "does this work or not". They tend to look good on paper, but I'm uncertain how much I'd use several of them due to some of the limitations/drawbacks. In the end, I may not end up doing much as far as rebalancing them goes as I was mostly just out to get some form of the Druidic Sorcerer kit to actually work and be stable in a game. My next sorcerer kit offering is the one I'm really going to worry about game balance over. Everyone needs to make at least one +12 hackmaster.
I'm currently doing a non-developer playthrough (no killswords and CLUAConsole) and so far I'm finding the kit to be versitile but not overpowered. The 15% experience penalty really hurts, so the class tends to be underleveled most of the time. Of course, I'm also playing with DEFJAM using a starting experience of 9000 for Player1, no xp from spell scribing, and 10% xp from picking locks and disarming traps. In a solo game this'd probably be different and I'm sure it will become less of an issue at the higher levels.
The Gorion suggestion is exactly what I'm looking for. Future versions will include a method for obtaining the kit at that point in the game.
I'm hoping to hear some feedback on the HLAs after some playtesting. Most of my playtesting was aimed at "does this work or not". They tend to look good on paper, but I'm uncertain how much I'd use several of them due to some of the limitations/drawbacks. In the end, I may not end up doing much as far as rebalancing them goes as I was mostly just out to get some form of the Druidic Sorcerer kit to actually work and be stable in a game. My next sorcerer kit offering is the one I'm really going to worry about game balance over. Everyone needs to make at least one +12 hackmaster.
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Posted 05 November 2007 - 09:14 PM
Caedwyr, on Nov 5 2007, 05:14 PM, said:
All the tracks can be followed if you gain enough levels, and none of the old sorcerer HLAs are selectable.
Okay. I was a little confused at first by the wording in the readme:
"Gains special High Level Abilities, including Quest Spells and Level 10 Wizard Spells."
#9
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Posted 06 November 2007 - 01:53 AM
I hope to be able to test a game soon Caedwyr so that i can help finding bugs. For now i can add some "paper comments":
- About BG1 part for BGT games. I disagree about Gorion. As your mentor, u know him very well for years and there is no point that, before or when, u leave Candlekeep "magically" u have a sudden "druidic feeling". It make more sense to have it WHEN u find Jaheria. May be a little quest related could be added if possible.
- It's not clear to me (sorry i still have to install the kit on a different game) if the GD works as "old" Druidic Sorcerer. I mean, u start as a Sorcerer and later u dual-class or receive innate abilities or available spells improving with levs? AFAIK is it NOT possible to select it from kits during character creation as DS, correct? It is fair AS SOON AS during the game a quest involves you becoming a GD ... and this should happen very early during the game.
mm75
PS: i will come back later with other comments and also found bugs when i'm able to setup a new test-game (i will do it in a BGT-only game).
- About BG1 part for BGT games. I disagree about Gorion. As your mentor, u know him very well for years and there is no point that, before or when, u leave Candlekeep "magically" u have a sudden "druidic feeling". It make more sense to have it WHEN u find Jaheria. May be a little quest related could be added if possible.
- It's not clear to me (sorry i still have to install the kit on a different game) if the GD works as "old" Druidic Sorcerer. I mean, u start as a Sorcerer and later u dual-class or receive innate abilities or available spells improving with levs? AFAIK is it NOT possible to select it from kits during character creation as DS, correct? It is fair AS SOON AS during the game a quest involves you becoming a GD ... and this should happen very early during the game.
mm75
PS: i will come back later with other comments and also found bugs when i'm able to setup a new test-game (i will do it in a BGT-only game).
Tired of the same boring spawned creatures u face in BG? Try BGSpawn
#10 Guest_John_*
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Posted 06 November 2007 - 09:16 AM
I started a new game as a geomantic sorcerer to see what it is like. At present, I'm solo level 9, saved the circus and am now attacking the slaver ship. So far, it's pretty fun using the added spells with those spells I usually choose as a sorc, although I suspect the kit might get rather powerful once I can start casting insect plague.
I have noticed a problem using the minor sequencer spell. I can see from my spell book that I have two magic missile spells available for casting. However, if I cast minor sequencer to put them in a sequencer, the list of spells shows only one magic missile. Also, when I chose the mm and then began choosing a level 2 spell, the mm I had selected and placed disappeared but I could place instead two of the level 2 spells as expected. After completing the spell, I checked my spell book and saw that I had two mm spells available for casting despite the minor sequencer having shown none. Minor sequencer seems to behave better if there are three or more mm spells available to place into the sequencer. Sequencers are one spell that all of my sorcs depend upon during the course of a game, so I hope you can resolve what's causing this problem.
John
I have noticed a problem using the minor sequencer spell. I can see from my spell book that I have two magic missile spells available for casting. However, if I cast minor sequencer to put them in a sequencer, the list of spells shows only one magic missile. Also, when I chose the mm and then began choosing a level 2 spell, the mm I had selected and placed disappeared but I could place instead two of the level 2 spells as expected. After completing the spell, I checked my spell book and saw that I had two mm spells available for casting despite the minor sequencer having shown none. Minor sequencer seems to behave better if there are three or more mm spells available to place into the sequencer. Sequencers are one spell that all of my sorcs depend upon during the course of a game, so I hope you can resolve what's causing this problem.
John
#12
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Posted 07 November 2007 - 02:09 AM
The old druidic sorcerer kit turned out to cause conflicts with shadowkeeper - will it also be impossible to edit via shadowkeeper if the Geomantic Sorcerer kit is installed?
Secondly, if there won't be a problem with shadowkeeper, will the Geomantic Sorcerer kit-spells be usable by other non-GM classes, if one edits them into the game via Shadowkeeper? I'm intending to use Fighter/Wild-Mage/Thieves and Fighter/Cleric/Mages for my various characters, and would like additional spells.
Secondly, if there won't be a problem with shadowkeeper, will the Geomantic Sorcerer kit-spells be usable by other non-GM classes, if one edits them into the game via Shadowkeeper? I'm intending to use Fighter/Wild-Mage/Thieves and Fighter/Cleric/Mages for my various characters, and would like additional spells.
#13
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Posted 07 November 2007 - 06:23 AM
The old Druidic Sorcerer kit relied heavily on scripts. The Geomantic Sorcerer Kit doesn't use any scripts other than for a couple summoned creatures. I haven't tested it with Shadowkeeper, but I don't see any reason why it would behave differently from other kits.
@John: I don't know why Magic Missile or the Sequencers would behave like that as I don't touch either of them. I'm going to be gone for 2 weeks, but I'll take a look when I get back.
@John: I don't know why Magic Missile or the Sequencers would behave like that as I don't touch either of them. I'm going to be gone for 2 weeks, but I'll take a look when I get back.
#14
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Posted 09 November 2007 - 03:39 AM
I do have another "reflection on paper".
If the kit does "start" during the game or through a quest, that kit WON'T be played by players who doesn't play BG games (i just think about CA or whatever total conversion mod).
Of course it's a choice, having the kit playable by everyone, or have a nice related quest in Bg (and Bg2) to become a true GS ...
mm75
If the kit does "start" during the game or through a quest, that kit WON'T be played by players who doesn't play BG games (i just think about CA or whatever total conversion mod).
Of course it's a choice, having the kit playable by everyone, or have a nice related quest in Bg (and Bg2) to become a true GS ...
mm75
Tired of the same boring spawned creatures u face in BG? Try BGSpawn
#15
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Posted 09 November 2007 - 08:54 AM
melkor_morgoth75, on Nov 9 2007, 03:44 AM, said:
I do have another "reflection on paper".
If the kit does "start" during the game or through a quest, that kit WON'T be played by players who doesn't play BG games (i just think about CA or whatever total conversion mod).
Of course it's a choice, having the kit playable by everyone, or have a nice related quest in Bg (and Bg2) to become a true GS ...
mm75
If the kit does "start" during the game or through a quest, that kit WON'T be played by players who doesn't play BG games (i just think about CA or whatever total conversion mod).
Of course it's a choice, having the kit playable by everyone, or have a nice related quest in Bg (and Bg2) to become a true GS ...
mm75
I may be wrong but I believe that it was not possible to have all of the Geomantic Sorcerer's abilities granted through the Kit selection interface, hence the in-game "discovery" of the kit.
On another note, I've been playing around the kit for a bit now. It's quite fun to play, and I'm really looking forward to the HLAs. I did experience the same minor sequencer bugs that another poster mentioned above.
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